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So there exist a significant minority of men who pursue sexual relationships with both adult men and women? This still seems to be what you're claiming and I still don't believe it. Haven't come across much of it in history, so its relevance is very limited. I was talking about cultural fruitfulness re Trannies. Throwing in the term "Shamanic" made that obvious. Today's trannies couldn't be more different. They are purely political creatures and utterly sterile. So we're gonna have a stoush over who gets Orton's 15yo's? He's referring to the pederastic dynamic as opposed to androphile or gay. The first boy I had an Aschenbachian meltdown over was 15yo. It was a bit late to do much about the misguided path he was on--if I'd met him three years earlier, I might have been of more use to him. You keep talking purely in terms of sexual attraction. But what comes with it counts, too. The desire for an ideal Greek love relationship, involving all the mentoring type activity that attends it--this might be cultural rather than biological in origin, but it carries real weight. The way one's heart breaks over a 12yo boy brings in powerful protective/guidance instincts -- it joins sex to societal purpose in a similar way to marriage. That's why it's been institutionalised so often. Uranians might have penned some nice ditties, but it's not a model for the average man and boy in the street. They need something more pragmatic. |