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Re: Dear Orange Turtle: Would I spank my child?

Posted by Manstuprator on 2023-November-9 01:27:05, Thursday
In reply to Re: Dear Auntie Karen: Should I spank my child? posted by Orange Turtle on 2023-November-8 23:08:04, Wednesday

I think that spanking kids actually puts them at risk. It makes them more violent. And then they could commit violent crimes and be killed by the police, executed, or assaulted in prison. It also increases the risk of illicit drug use and legal and illegal drug addiction.


I assume when you say, "puts them at risk" you mean that spanking usually or always "causes" certain other behaviors?

You say, "It makes them more violent." It usually or always causes children to be MORE violent than children who are NOT spanked?

"They could commit violent crimes." "Could" (as well as "can," "may," "might,") introduces probabilities. What would you estimate the probability of that being true? On a scale of one to ten, one being not probable and 10 being almost certain?

And any estimates that you would make, would they be based on evidence? Has the question been studied using good science?

Science is the only thing we have to try to tease out what is real from what is not real. Science provides a method to establish with greater certainty that something may be true (or may NOT be true). Are you basing your opinions on research that has been done on the question?

Do you actually support spanking kids? Because I think supporting spanking kids makes pro-contacters look bad. To support non-consensually touching kids by spanking them, but also support sexual relations with kids? What if someone puts two and two together and figures you support child molestation? Not saying I think you do.


In general, I think that "spanking" (bending a child over, removing his clothing, and repeatedly striking the bare buttocks of) young people after the age that they have developed the ability to reason (and to be reasoned with) is counterproductive. It serves little or no real service and is likely to cause more harm than good.

BUT -- when dealing with very young children (up to the age of around 4 or 5) reasoning does not work well (if at all). So, in the case of behaviors that could cause serious bodily harm to them (being hit by a car, scalding themselves with falling pots from stoves, for example) physical punishment can be very effective in eliminating the dangerous behaviors when it is done immediately after the undesired behavior (but if more than a few minutes have passed after the behavior, the effect is lost) at least, according to the best evidence available. A child up to the age of 4 or 5 will usually avoid behaviors that he/she has been physically punished for (if the physical punishment is immediate and the child clearly associates it with the behavior).

BUT -- and this is essential -- the punishment should not cause any real physical harm to the child -- no bruising, no broken bones, no long-term physical damage. So what would a "mild" physical punishment be? There are experts who recommend a quick blow to the buttocks of the standing child, with an open hand, accompanied by a loud "NO!" This has been shown to work to discourage behaviors in very young children.

The argument that using corporal punishment always makes the child think that violence is an acceptable way to deal with resolving conflicts with others ignores a number of realities and lacks nuance.

In fact, if young people came to believe that a single swat on the behind were the acceptable way to resolve the majority of conflicts between individuals, then I think that society in general would see a lot LESS really serious violence.

Imagine two men arguing in a bar. One decides to physically attack the other in an effort to dominate him. So he swats the other, with an open hand, on the other's buttocks. Which the other then reciprocates. They continue doing this until one or the other gives in. Wouldn't that be better than a fist fight?

Whether people will "put two and two together" by my suggesting that a single swat on the clothed buttocks of a very young child immediately following the child having done something that threatens its life, equates to my supporting the use of force or violence to control a child's body so that I may perform sexual acts on the child only for my pleasure is, I believe, unlikely.

By the way, I'm pro-contact, but I'm more than that. I'm a child sexual liberationist. I believe in child liberation in general, and that includes sexual. It also includes non-sexual. Just like children have the right not to be sexually abused, they also have the right not to be non-sexually abused. Including being spanked. Note that spanking can be sexual sometimes. In that case it's molestation.


You're talking about giving young people the option of choosing -- giving them "agency". But is that always a good idea, and in every case?

How does "spanking" become a sexualized behavior?

Do you think that the "swat" I have described above is likely to become sexual in the mind of a child?

OFF TOPIC: How about introducing yourself a little? BUT -- if you don't understand how giving certain details could endanger your personal security, then it is better if you don't give any specific details. Information is available on this -- first, read the FAQ. Then there is more detailed info available, too, if you are interested.

What do you think?

M.



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